Mains electric tripping question

[olive]

I have lived with our campo 3 phase supply and power cuts for some years. I had and still have little desire for Endesa to come and fit the device (RCB?) that supposedly protects your household components from the vagaries of their supply. Two reasons for not wanting this. 1. Never had any damage in the past. 2 Have got two UPS's keeping things like Sky boxes working during the frequent split second duration outages.

Recently something has changed however as now when the electric does come back on the yellow "test button" switch has tripped and needs resetting. In the past it very rarely ever did this. Now it is about 50% or more of occurences. Damned annoying if you have been out for the day.

Our household electrics haven't been changed nor have the amount or type of appliances left on changed except for the introduction of a cheap Sweex UPS to keep the phone and modem alive. I can't see the latter being the culprit but have tried with it disconnected and not proved anything one way or the other.

Anyone cast any light on why we now have more trips than before? Could I change the yellow test switch for something less sensitive? It is a PFIM 40/4/003 with a 15A mains switch.

olive

[Beachcomber]

These switches do wear out after a while and replacing it with a new one may solve the problem. However, if funds will run to it, I would suggest an ELCB which resets automatically:

http://www.portalelectricidad.es/difere ... -2583.html

[Enrique]

Hi Olive,
Interesting that you have a 3 phase supply in the campo, my experience is you're lucky to get a single phase. , Guess there is campo and campo
Have you check your Earth connection
My understanding is the "limiter" the electric company fits is in relation to your contracted potencia, so for 3.3Kw a 15Amp trip would be fitted. This doesn't stop any "vagaries of their supply", it just stops you pulling more than your contracted potencia.

[olive]

mm the earth maybe a problem as we haven't had much (any?) rain this year and the ground will have dried out. I'll get a meter on that.

The 15 amp mains switch. We are paying for 5Kw (actually 4.9 on the bill) what should that be then?!

Thanks Beachcomber. Will have a look at that link. Maybe the yellow switch is worn out!

olive

[Enrique]

Hi Olive,
So you're on single phase........ Amps = Watts/Volts, 5000/240 = 20.8 amps
So you should have 20Amp trip on the incoming supply.

[El Cid]

Olive said it was three phase - I have 3 phase in the campo.

Originally I was billed for 4.9kw although according to the contract I could take 15kw and did not have an ICP because it was not required if you had the night meter.

They have now fitted a new ICP and I am billed for 13.8kw (ouch). The ICP is 60 amps (60x230v=13.8kw) - unfortunately as it is 3 phase it is actually a triple 20a fuse so the three phases have to be carefully distributed around the house as each circuit can only take 4.6kw before all the circuits trip. Its a crazy system - typical Endesa. I would get a better cheaper supply going back to a single phase 40amp/9.2 kw supply!

Sid

[Beachcomber]

My understanding is the "limiter" the electric company fits is in relation to your contracted potencia, so for 3.3Kw a 15Amp trip would be fitted. This doesn't stop any "vagaries of their supply", it just stops you pulling more than your contracted potencia.

This is an ICP. (Interruptor de Control de Potencia) I think what Olive may be referring to is a transient voltage surge suppressor which fits on the DIN rail with the other circuit breakers but you have to buy and fit this yourself. Unless one of these is fitted Endesa will not even entertain any claim for damage cause by power surges.

By the way, I also have a three phase supply but it was initially an agricultural installation for operating the well pump etc.

[Enrique]

Hi Lads,
Not saying you can't get 3 phase ..........El Cid runs a command module and as Beach is in an "agricultural installation" proving the point.
I'm just grateful for any volts that happen to leak down my wires.

[olive]

That is why I don't really want to get Endesa involved. I just know that the recurring costs will rocket and the service be very little better if at all. They might even make me pay to renew wooden poles and overhead wires.

Although we have 3 phase one phase is about 174 volts so is worse than useless. The other two phases are distributed fairly evenly over the house. The overhead wires are quite small and are 30 odd years old.

That ELCB is the dogs B's but quite a price , I will try renewing the yellow test switch first. Although it was "new" five years ago there is no saying it wasn't already secondhand now judging by the electricians that did the work.

olive

[Beachcomber]

I used to have the same problem with low voltage but I have to say that about two years ago Sevillana upgraded the transformer and replaced the overhead cables and wooden posts at no cost to anyone. I now have around 220 volts on each phase.

It was a probably a coincidence but this was about a year after I won a court case against them for €600 worth of damage to the control panel of my generator which was caused by a power surge.

They were lucky it wasn't more because my UPSes protected the rest of my electronic equipment.

Olive, think carefully about your options regarding the replacement ELCB. If you buy a new one and you still have the same problem you will not be any further forward and will still need the one with the automatic reset.

If you buy it from an electrical wholesaler who will sell directly to the public you should get a good discount on it.